Every now and then you see something that really makes you scratch your head in utter amazement. This is one of those times...
His gayship, OC Allen, has struck once again taking the ridiculousness of his sexual perversion to completely new heights in order to advance the pretend gospel of homosexuality and normalize evil and perversion among the church community...
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| bishop O C Allen, the first gentleman Rashard Burgess & Caylee LaTanya |
The leaders of the VisionLESS Cathedral of Atlanta now claim to be proud new parents of "baby Burgess-Allen"... ...Yes, you read it right. Apostate bishop O.C Allen, whom we featured on this blog and youtube some time ago, and his wife/husband, (Rashard Burgess) known as the "first gentleman" (my LORD have mercy!) have seduced someone somehow into giving up their child, claims to be parents of a newborn, and expects everyone to rejoice because of it...According to sources their confusion is as follows:
"We are proud to announce the birth of a healthy 8.1 lbs. baby, born Thursday January 10, 2013 at 8:23am. The surprise is that it's a little girl! Her name is, Caylee LaTanya Burgess-Allen. She's so precious and we love how she has already brought such meaning to our lives. We are humbled and grateful to have such loving and supportive grandparents, godparents, family, a loving Church, faith community, coworkers and beautiful friends who are committed to us.Please pray for us as we love little Caylee and support us as we expand our family and complete the adoption process.
“Welcome home our Princess, little Caylee”
Your Dads.
WHAT IN THE WORLD IS THAT????
Some FAKE garbage! Why do I say that?
To begin with, Georgia doesn't even allow same sex marriage or civil unions of same sex couples. So these folk are not only in homosexual sin, they are in violation of even the laws of the state. So the baby is forced to be in something that is a "pretense", at least at the moment. Her NATURAL parents gave her up and the men that she will be living with are not married according to law and claim to be her "dads". This is a blatant lie! Are they serious???? How can they possibly be???
Secondly, Georgia has no universal ruling on the adoption of children by same sex or gay couples. Since gay relationships are not the law, all that gay "parents" can do is file petition to adopt, which may be granted in certain venues or counties for non-natural parents, but has never been ruled on in the law of the state. The laws are as follows:
- Same sex couples have the right to file a formal petition to adopt, as the law permits anyone over the age of 25 to submit an application. (GA. CODE ANN. § 19-8-3.)
- There are no express prohibitions against a same sex couple from filing jointly to adopt, however there have been no rulings on the issue.
- There are no express prohibitions against a same sex partner filing to adopt the other partner’s child
As stated, two people, who are BIOLOGICALLY MEN, didn't produce a child. This had to be planned on some level. Since they just didn't happen to pick up a child like a 2 liter soda at the store, how can they say that they experienced anything like "surprise" that the baby was or is a girl??? Did they not check with the real WOMAN who carried the baby for 9 months as to the gender of the child in the HER WOMB?
Being that the law is what it is, it may be a safe assumption that only ONE of them (Allen or Burgess) adopted or otherwise paid for the child. (I wonder will the REAL mother ever speak up, or has she been paid to forever be quiet and just go away?) If one them (Allen or Burgess) already claims to be a woman, (and I can't tell which one that is) then that one, can't be a dad even if he were single. The best he can be is a "male figure" who wants to be a female. So once again, this baby is being introduced to another lie.
Don't even try to normalize this mess in the context of the church for it is UTTER CONFUSION!!!!! There is lie on top of lie and a precious child in the middle and the expectation is for noone to say anything and all to simply show "love"in the name of "Christianity"? Well, who loves this baby enough to point out that these grown, stank behind people are wrong???? Who loves her enough to say, this mess has to and must stop?
I pray that this little girl grows to be a mighty and strong advocate for the word of God and stands firm AGAINST the homosexual confusion that her "pretend dads" and apostate church embraces. Like all the other children coming up through that ministry because of deluded parents who continue to be deceived, I pray that her mind and spirit is protected from all further ungodliness and perversion of the flesh such as what this "minister" and church sets forth and what apostate minds such as these endorse in this day we call the "modern age" or modern era.
This is ridiculously sick from the standpoint of all the lies that it takes to make this have some kind of "appearance" of normalcy and because of the brain washing and emotional and spiritual confusion that this baby is already subject to. May the Lord have mercy upon her and the very best of blessings, and may that blessing begin by helping those closest to her denounce their sins, repent of their evil and come back to God and make a stand for righteousness.
IN JESUS NAME I pray!
Amen!!!!!!
Blessed!
From GCMWatch.com
ReplyDeleteTHIS is *exactly* why homosexuality is unnatural in every sense of the word. Everything they do is through artificial means because they have zero capacity to produce any natural life. And that extends to spiritual life. These two men are posterboys for the real meaning of perversion now bringing this child into their deception play house/play church game.
ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!
ReplyDeleteTHANK YOU VERY MUCH!
God Makes No Mistakes! How dare you! You know how fortunate that little girl is to have a family! Love is love. Until you understand that concept you are lost. Love does not see gender, or race... all you see is hate... they will do nothing but raise that little girl to be the best person she can be. What do you care what goes on behind closed doors? Its awful people like you preach to the masses about trivial things such as this when there are real problems in the world that you could be praying for. FYI sir... you can't pray away the gay... I must say you ruined my day with this story... wake up and embrace change... because this too shall pass and when it does you will take all this negativity back
ReplyDeleteGood Day
Brande,
ReplyDeleteLove is NOT just love. Love is SACRIFICE, NOT SELFISHNESS.
The sin of homosexuality is one thing, bringing an innocent into someone's confusions such as this shows the height and epitome of selfishness and arrogance.
They will not raise this girl to be the "person she can be"...they will raise her in the same gender confusion that they have embraced and possibly even worse.
We all care what goes on behind closed doors don't we? we care who robs, steals, lies, snorts cocaine, cheats and everything don't we? We all care about the welfare of one another. The law sends people to jail for what goes on behind closed doors don't they? So your sentiment is a novel speculation but NOT a truth.
Finally, if one can't pray gay away, then one can't pray pedophilia away, the tendency to rape away, bestiality away, polygamy away or virtually any other sexual impulse that one can think of away.
We ALL know that is the most ridiculous thing ever heard. People can change and do change EACH and EVERY day. Obviously you don't believe in any kind of evolution, if that is the case, you MUST believe in God. If that is the case you MUST also believe in God's ability to change man. With that said, you would also have to know that man is imperfect and in need of change. If these things are true, and homosexuality is condemned, not only spiritually, but also naturally based on solidly founded natural principles as well, then you MUST accept that homosexuality is wrong, condemned and unacceptable both to God and men....
How dare YOU or anyone else think it acceptable under these circumstance to introduce a child to that backward and ungodly filthiness and call it progress...
That is not being negative, it's called being REAL!
See, there is NO PROOF that people can't and don't change, but there is PLENTY of proof that they do!
ReplyDeleteIf the "straight" can become gay, then certainly the gay, can come to their right mind and become STRAIGHT. one can;t simply disregard the personal experience and testimony of the thousands who have left sexual perversion for wholeness. Simply can't be done.
These men are doing a serious disservice to the Body of Christ. They both should abandon this lifestyle if they want to continue ministering or step down for a season. Believe it or not, Allen used to be under Bishop Flunder but branched out on his own. He has never explained why that happened. I have watched the YouTube interview Lexi did at Vision Cathedral and I am not convinced that nothing Biblical is going on there. I pray that the little girl would be covered by the blood of Jesus. This is just wrong for them to do that even if they think it is a "blessing."
ReplyDeleteJohnny Hopkins,
ReplyDeleteAMEN!
Many of these folk are caught up in the "feeling" or worship as an authentication for this Bishop's message. Well I certainly FEEL GREAT while preaching against this heresy. So what is the difference?
The difference is that my "feelings" are in accord with the word of God and the word of god is TRUE. in other words I have an external witness as well as an internal one.
In a biblical mandate, we need more than one witness to truth. Since the witness of "feelings" and people is subjective, we need an objective witness. The word of God is that witness.
It doesn't matter how these folk "feel" about the ministry, it is still UNGODLY, UNBIBLICAL, HERETICAL and rejected of God. If it is not, HIS word is wrong. If HIS word is wrong, then what are we doing?
It's just that simple, somebody is lieing. Let GOD be TRUE and every man a liar.
Harvey you said: If straight can be gay then gay can be straight. What a riddle. Leave the child alone. She will be in a home that will love her. You are pro-lifer right? You should be rejoicing to God for a child being placed in a good home but instead you praise your god of hate.
ReplyDeleteWord4thesoul,
ReplyDeleteYou're "almost" right...I am happy that she wasn't aborted, that is indeed a blessing, but it's like this...
You have a person starving and you feed them food from the garbage and give them dirty water to drink...
Have you helped them or showed them compassion and love by feeding them that???? Absolutely not! To do that to them is hatred. To not speak up, if you know this, is hatred....
So who in this scenario is displaying hate to any degree?
You seem to have a twisted version of what love is, especially when it comes to gay men. I have seen your version of love in action. Speak up yes but if your issue is with homosexuality how about you and others get together and work on prevention.
ReplyDeleteGerald,
ReplyDeleteWhat I do is preventative and I do much more than this by the way.
The fact is that if a person doesn't know that what they are doing is wrong, then for sure they will continue. Maybe, warning a person will cause them to arrest their behavior, but at times certain behavior should be stopped, not only for their benefit, but for the benefit of all.
Now, since my version of love is "twisted" (according to you), answer this so we can see how twisted it really is....
I believe you have children (if memory serve me correctly) and I know, without doubt, that you love them dearly and even with you life...
Now, they are taking a trip and will drive on a road that has been known for destructive traffic accidents under certain weather conditions. You are aware of this, they are not fully aware of the danger, although they have heard about it some incidents....There is a travel advisory and the conditions are conducive to a tragic accident especially in that particular area or road...
What do you do?...Let them go on with a casual warning to "be careful" because of what the history has been or do you more specifically act in their best interest by stopping them from going?
Remember, stopping them makes them angry, but may well save their lives.
Which one is greater love...making them angry or allowing them to proceed?
Funny. Love is an action and there is much more to love than warning. Many of you who have disregard for our gay brothers claim that your harsh words are love and you are warning them out of love.
ReplyDeleteThe gay community and especially gay Christians are quite aware of your warnings but they know The Love of God for themselves. What I see from you is name calling, shame and a true disrespect and disregard for mainly gay men.
Now regarding your question to me, warnings out of love truly work when you have an established relationship with a person. The warnings that we find in the Bible from Paul (this is where most Christians get there warn your brother in love, etc. theology from) are coming from a time when there were more personal relationships with the church members.
Now, we are a global community and so-called warnings and rebuke don't work because that relationship has not been established and they also fall flat when there is no positive reinforcement.
Have you ever tried to reach out to these two brothers? Have you ever had a one on one conversation with either one of them?
Gerald,
ReplyDeleteLet's start with the latter first:
Yes, I reached out to these folk in 2010 a full 2 months before I wrote the first article and asked certain questions. THEY never responded.
Yes, there is much more to love than warning. But it is NOT love to warn when warranted.
There is no such thing as a "gay Christian", but anyone's subjective opinion of their salvation against the objective truth of God is just that...subjective opinion. So there is no way that they can "know" the love of God for themselves. That is an impossibility.
So far as the "warnings" of Paul, those things weren't dependent upon Paul's relationship with the people. These warnings were sent and directed by God through Paul as a vessel. That needs no humanistic intervention or relationship either for authenticity or effectiveness.
Now that requirement is a purely humanistic requirement. It is devoid of any sensitivity to God's Spirit, which Jesus describes as incomprehensible as he describes the Spirit in John 8:3.
What the homosexual advocate and the homosexual that also wants to believe in Jesus for salvation requires, is a way to bypass men and directly access God to make an appeal to HIS mercy. In other words, the sentiment, as you express readily is that all men are wrong regarding the issue.
What this actually is, is an attempt to diminish the authority of the word of God by creating another standard of acceptance. The standard is subjective and based on the sentiment that "God understands me" and because he "understands me" he there fore "loves and accepts me" no matter what I do.
For the life of me, I can't see why YOU and those who hold your view, can;t see the obvious and glaring not only inconsistency, but glaring logical flaw in thinking such....I mean ANYONE, doing ANYTHING that they like or feel that they are "born with", no matter how horrendous the activity may be, can promote the same argument.
Where there is no absolute truth or right, then all things are subject to the whim of men. That is not how anyone should approach either god nor his word and to do so lowers God from God to a simple method whereby we receive relief of mental burdens. That is NOT the God of the bible. The God of the bible saves FROM sins, but he first convicts sinners of their sins and he does, at times, use human agency to do that.
I said: "But it is NOT love to warn when warranted"
ReplyDeleteI meant, but it is NOT love to withhold warning when warranted.
Harvey, religion is just that, the whims of men that is why we must depend on God speaking within us through his unfiltered Word and through the Holy Spirit.
ReplyDeleteYou can say all day that there is no such thing as a Gay Christian but it is not your call to say likewise. So, how do you plan on ending homosexuality for future generations? If it is such a big deal and issue in the church shouldn't we be focused on prevention? Oh wait, sexual orientation is neither chosen nor changed. I mean you can prevent a person from taking their first thrink, first smoke or even stealing their first car. But you can't prevent sexual orientation. And give the whole pedophile argument a rest because it doesn't look good for straight men; most of them are heterosexual men.
Gerald,
ReplyDeleteNeither is it YOUR call to say what the scripture does not say and that is people with inordinate sexual affections can maintain them and still be saved, yet alone call themselves Christians. You would have a FIT if I came on here touting a trailer-load of women as the source of my sexual affections...Why? Because you know that is wrong not only subjectively, but objectively by the word of God.
In addition, so far as God speaking, what is your epistemology for that? If there is nothing that is an objective standard outside of both you and I as a source of truth and right, then there is NOTHING but banter and bicker and no real truth. Neither can there can be a determination as to who is right and who is wrong and all actions, no matter how morally reprehensible are EQUAL.
Can you imagine pedophilia, which is advocated for by HOMOSEXUAL advocates, and rape being morally equivalent to chastity and sexual purity?
It is interesting that the homosexual advocate, such as yourself, spends MUCH time claiming that people who hold views such as mine, are wrong, but by what standard is that measured?
I present an objective standard...the WORD of God...you yet judge that my "interpretation" of that standard is flawed. Only your interpretation of it, relegates it to anything but an objective basis or standard.
The web you create is this, if all things are only subjectively true, then your version of truth is no better than mine.
This is the danger of your view and what you espouse. In seeking to undermine my view, you obliterate yours and any criticism you can render. It simply becomes "white noise".
Gerald,
ReplyDeleteSo far as sexual "orientation"....PLEASE!
ALL sex is a CHOICE. Affections are to be honed and trained like anything else and every other part of our being. A person will only love and be attracted to what he or she gives themselves to be attracted to.
Humans learn how to love and even who to love. The only reason we know love is right is because there is objective truth. That same objective truth facilitates the understanding that not all love is equal and not all actions are to be embraced. In other words love, like all things, is defined by truth.
The "lassie-fare" approach to relationships, love and affection may be what people want, only just so happens that, many times, what people wants goes against what God wants of people.
If there is no standard of right and truth, even in love, other than which is in your mind or someone elses, then we are ALL jacked up!
Pastor Burnett, long time my brother! how is everything? I hope all is well with you.
ReplyDeleteFirst - this is disgusting.
Secondly - These are false teachers, it is plain and simple. Where in scripture does it say to treach folks like this with a gentle hand? Jesus called them wolves in sheeps clothing. These men are leading many to hell with a smile.
As far as warning in love and the need for a relationship to do so, that has been put forth. Lets look at people who go to schools and talk about the dangers of drunk driving. Many times these people were foolish in their youth got drunk and caused harm and they want to use their experience to help others. Now, do these people have to have a relationship with every student before having the audacity (it seems)to try to warn them? surely not, because that would make no sense at all. Also, it is quite obvious that it would be in the best interest of the students to take heed, unless we will conclude that the speakers did not have a relationship with them so they ought not to listen?
Prov
5let the wise listen and add to their learning,
and let the discerning get guidance—
7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge,
but fools[c] despise wisdom and instruction.
The child of God cannot decide what is sin and what is not, God has done that. It is however the Job of the child of God and those who have been called to lead to state plain what God says. God says homosexuality is sin, so one cannot embrace homosexuality as correct in the sight of The Most High and then call themselves a Christian.
ReplyDeletePaul,
ReplyDeleteYes, it has been a long time and good to hear from you again.
You're absolutely correct. If there is a right and a wrong that is absolute, men certainly didn't establish it.
This has explicit impact on the sexual issue and 100%.
What Palmer and other that advocate for the approval of this sin do, is reestablish humanity and self as if it is the creator of truth, right and wrong. That type of sentiment is moral relativism. Moral
relativism is only as good as the majority in power or the rulemakers themselves. So even under that scheme they are subject to the whim of men.
So quite a few arguments can be lifted against not only homosexuality in general but also homosexual marriage, which includes, genetics, morality, anatomy and physiology, psychological, social and economic, and all of that before we even crack open the bible to discover what God says is right or wrong.
As I said, people should live in control of "feelings" and emotions, but I understand that some people have no control or at least relinquish control. One can love a lot of people and a lot of things, if one allows themselves to. The homosexual advocate is hard pressed to explain why their sin should be rewarded by the state when the sin of others such as polygamists, pedophiles and even others that "feel" they have a natural sexual attraction and proclivity towards their sins should be prohibited. I haven't heard ANY intelligible response to that from any of them yet on that issue.
True dat Pastor. Man has become our own God in a world where every man does what is right in his own sight.
ReplyDeleteYou said So quite a few arguments can be lifted against not only homosexuality in general but also homosexual marriage, which includes, genetics, morality, anatomy and physiology, psychological, social and economic, and all of that before we even crack open the bible to discover what God says is right or wrong.
YES! I say let homosexuality stand on its own. Take emotions (they are quite misleading at times, that is why people say they love a married individual and will sleep with them) and the animal kingdom out of it. Lets separate the act and its consequences and lets see how good and right it is. One looks at the effects of smoking cigarettes and the conclusion is that is it unhealthy, even though all men who smoke don't die of lung cancer.
It is a life style that cannot stand on its own feet because the body is not designed to suit it (The anus is not a sexual organ and neither is a fake penis) and it cannot produce life.
It should be simple but sin is no joke. It robs people of simple common sense.
And this is one sin that has robbed even the most smart of ANY common sense.
ReplyDeleteIt must be really rewarding and it must "feel good" to know you can promote anti gay sentiments by using the Bible to back you up.....The Bible..The Bible..The Bible...i pray for your sake The Bible aka Word of God is correct...and everything you believe it says is what it says...otherwise you will have some explianing to do!
ReplyDeleteAntwoine,
Deleteyou pose and interesting scenario. Let's say for a minute that the bible is incorrect...to whom will I or anyone have to explain anything and by what standard will anyone's "explanation" be judged?
You have some explaining to do to these two wonderful parents, their daughter and the entire LGBT community.....im sure these two gentlemen are proud to be parents and could care less about what you believe...so perhaps you wont have to explain anything...the obvious is the obvious...you are a hater...using The Word of God to spread your hate of what the Bible says is a "sin"...oh so since the Bible and God calls it a sin...then im free to hate on that sin.....The Bible if anything should give you cover to understand and accept people for who they are rather than to discredit them...or to go as far as to pray a daughter grows up to dislike who her parents are...makes you go hmmmmmm....
ReplyDeleteThe point is that if I am wrong, I don't have to explain ANYTHING to anyone either ultimately or in the near short-term. For over 4500 years none have proved the bible to be incorrect and if it would happen to be incorrect, then who is anyone held accountable to? The answer is no one. In fact, if I am wrong, what moral duty do I or anyone have to do the right thing at all.
DeleteThat is the point my friend. Since you identify that there is a right, I mean you accuse me of "hate" of all things, and "if" the bible is wrong, then why should I do "right"? What is the motivator? In fact let's go further, how do you KNOW, that what they are doing is right? how does anyone know this "right" that you are speaking of? What is the means or the method that you use to determine this IF the bible is wrong?
Further, gaydom and gay marriage can be rejected without even opening the bible. There are all kinds of problems associated with the lifestyle. The physical body isn't even designed for that garbage. That by itself should be an indicator, not to mention disease, which is still most rampant among MSM and mental issues which still cannot be denied.
Since these gay men are NOT God, then I'm not worried about being judged in any way by them, but we both identify that there is a right and a wrong and an ultimate answer to and for it. The only thing is that you are confused about what is right, what is wrong and what or who anyone will answer to.
Now, answer this...if my disdain for homosexuality in general and rejection of any homosexual right to marry is based or rooted in "hate", then how and on what basis do you deny pedophiles or polygamists the same rights and treat them (especially pedophiles) with the same or similar disdain?
Then explain how and on what basis that you deny rapists the same rights to continue their rape especially those that believe that they were born with those feelings and inclinations and have an overwhelming orientation to rape? How are they denied their "right" to do what they "feel" they should do? if the bible is wrong, how is the standard that they are "wrong" established?
What and how are your actions and sentiments "right" as it pertains to those groups of individuals in denying them their rights to marry and consummate their relationships?
Can you name any court case where a rapist, polygamist or a pedophile is suing or marching or holding a rally to protect their right to rape, marry a minor or marry multiple people? (Mormons excluded..by the way many of the characters you idolized in your Bible were polygamist)...
ReplyDeleteAntwoine,
DeleteGay advocates and those such as the North American Men Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) who idolize gay pedophile Harry Hay, (Which has recently been honored by the US Government) are the one's advocating for the acceptance of man/boy aka CHILD lust and the legalization of such all around the world. His efforts aren't championed by heterosexual men. They are championed by those who identify themselves as gay. That is NOT a stereotype, it is simply a fact based on what THEY set forth themselves.
In addition, there is a brand of psychology that feels that rapists and certain murderers, especially those who have a sexual attraction and "natural urges" (as you describe your gay attraction) cannot be held accountable for what they do. That what they feel is some sort of "right path" for them, even though others find it repulsive. One bloggerput it like this:
"You and I live in a society where fraternities ask brothers who they’d want to rape in surveys, where university health centers tell victims that they “don’t believe them” because their rape statistics would look worse, where a community can point to an 11 year old girl and say she didn’t do enough to stop the people who gang raped her. You and I live in a society that has normalized the idea that sex is something that SHOULD be given, to the point that it is no longer respected when people choose not to give it. (Not that it is respected when they choose to give it, either). You and I live in a society where 1 in 5 women will be the victim of a sexual assault crime at some point in her life."
We are not living in a bubble. I can only ask that you open your eyes and view this issue and all of them with a little more vigor. NO ONE hates gays, we hate the advancement of the gay agenda because of the baggage and absolute garbage that it represents and what it contributes to, which is not good for anyone, gay or straight. And one need not simply use the bible to reject this mess...it deserves rejection on a prima-fascia basis.
I never heard of this group...but nothing from their website suggest they are advocating for marriage....or acceptance....and if they are....good luck...dont see America advancing child abuse.....and I dont know any gay person who would support them...ok including the couple you critize.
DeleteThe Gay Agenda?....i only have one agenda.....to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness...which if I want that too include a man who I want marry legally I can...in ny state btw..its legal..so is having a baby if I want too....thats my agenda....not rape..and abusing minors
DeleteI am not one that believes one is born gay!..so lets get that out of the way.....for me..i CHOSE to act upon my natural urges..that I began having as early as 7th grade...i was never molested and I was raised in home with my father and mother, 4 other brothers and 1 sister and I never saw gay porn until I was 21....so where did these urges come from the devil..you say?...well I can tell you my experience with men have been wonderful, very satisfying and pleasurable and according to my last physical examination, which included an anal examination upon my request and a prostrate examination all of which deemed me a clean bill of health!!!!and im 40...my first male to male experience I was 17 years old!!!!!...so you can keep all of your statics...i am not one of them!
ReplyDeleteThen if you believe that being gay is a "CHOICE" then on what basis is it a "right"? You see in NORMAL society, those of us who "CHOSE" something, don't normally expect others to validate that choice in law.
DeleteThe LUST that envelopes you in the homosexual lifestyle simply is what it is...lust and sin. See I look at it in a more absolute manner, because there is an absolute truth, right and wrong and that truth has been revealed.
Why do men love their lust? Because their "heart" is bound. Here's the reference I can use to support my belief regarding that:
John 3:19-21 ~ 19-And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20-For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. 21-But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
You see, there is something there that I will admit that you didn't readily chose. I don't think anyone would chose to be wrong in any way on their own. However there is a spiritual principle at work beyond your ability to recognize choice. That spiritual principle works in all of our hearts whether we recognize it or not. It is called "flesh", "ungodliness" and the trivialization of it is called "carnality" This is where you are regarding that issue.
The ABSOLUTELY true guide, and authority on the subject says this as well:
James 1:14-15 ~ 14-But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15-Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
We "own lust" and when we are presented with certain things, no matter the age, we have a propensity to chose it. So even a 7 year old boy can chose lust and affection for another man because he is carnal in his thought pattern. It takes teaching and the power of God to deliver that precious son from the absolute bound and bondage of that sin.
Could it be a heterosexual sin as equally as dangerous? YES!!!! For many and most it is, heterosexual LUST that is played out out of control in various forms of sexual addictions and fetishes. Will they get a pass? ABSOLUTELY NOT! All wrong is wrong. We are simply talking about why your wrong is wrong and why it should not advance onto the realm of normalcy. Somebody done lost their mind, and it SURE AIN'T those of us who can see this garbage for what it is and the damage it both poses and brings...
You say that you have made it at age 40 because you passed some tests...well, what about the other homosexual men who comprise about 60% of all new HIV cases annually? Are you to "one up" them as if you are more special than they? It was "them' who weren't careful huh? They deserve their plight because they were more nasty than you? You know I don't believe you think of feel that way, but your statements beg the question.
One person smokes all their life and nothing too much happens, another same age and length of time smoking dies of emphysema...is smoking somehow not hazardous to one's health because there is a survivor? I think not!
Lust is the same as passion...its only evil if it becomes self fish.....thats not bible..but its my moral compass...which is again is not Biblically based....so you can quote scripture all day...i dont view the world in such broad strokes..right or wrong...that exist in your world..in my world...wrong can be right and right can be wrong....now you trying to suggest I am not concern with people infected by HIV because I am not is silly...u can do better....i only brought up clean health record because you sir stated MY lifestyle was damaging....as if being Gay is more damaging than being heterosexual....please.....
DeleteAntwoine,
DeleteNow, you say you "define" lust as passion. Now that is something you made up. That is called relativism. Passion is a nearly uncontrollable emotion whereas lust is a strong sexual desire or desire for something. What you do is redefinition to suit. The only problem with that is where and by what means is that method refrained or redefined? Here's what I mean:
Let's take robbery for example. Now I can say that robbery is taking something that isn't deserved or earned. Another can say that robbery is taking something when someone is hurt as a result. What has been done is a different standard has been evoked. Robbery is no longer robbery based on the action, but based on how someone "feels" about the action. The redefinition is as only as good as my mind. it is not binding on anyone or anything else. In fact it opens the door for all others to have their own definition and what do we have or end up with??? CHAOS! No truth and even the most stupid opinion is just as good as the best idea. That is the most silly proposition in the world, but that is exactly what is created by redefining to suit.
The fact is that if there is no standard by which things are defined and no real truth or value, we have nothing. You might as well applaud the very most vile for the sick feelings they have and pursue, for they are just as good as the very best efforts of those you hold as most dear and above reproach.
The morality of "harm" is also not a good way to determine truth. There are many things that aren't or don't appear to be "harmful" but they are. homosexuality is simply one of those things.
In your opinion homosexuality is one of those things that dont appear to be harmful.....
DeleteAnd then you use the word "But"....and proceded in saying "they are"...harmful that is...we homosexuals....many things are harmful...no amounts of "BUT" can change that fact!
DeleteHomosexuality doesn't "appear" to be harmful to the homosexual, even though numbers and facts by a number of different criteria show and display otherwise.
DeleteThere are a number of facts that show that just being human is harmful in the age of global warming....lets not go down this rode....i know if you gave me a description of your eating habits or even what you ate for dinner last night and I can show you just how harmful your body is.....i bet you still eat fast food....and talk about harmful......heart disease is the # 1 killer of black men..along with drugs and gun violence..whats interesting is that the same life expectancy of black men in slavery time is the same as gay black men now..40 years...thats interesting..but im not all convince these reports are accurate when it comes to life expectancy...most research is bias...and that includes my side and yours...I wish there truly was an independant, non political or non religious view of the subject matter as it relates to life expectancy for gay men and straight....at end of the day..if being who I am reduces my life span by 20 or even 7 years....so what?.. We are just passing thru anyway right....in fact according to the research just being a black male reduces life expectancy lower than non black males......as far me ill live as long as I am supposed to live and I will njoy every minute of my life...im even njoying this conversation because if nothing else its thought provoking...
DeleteSee, you miss the point that I am making my friend. there are many harmful things whether known now or not. We don't live simply by what is harmful, neither do we live by what is hedonistic or pleasureful. Where there is no standard men call right wrong and wrong right. Our "perception" is simply an illusion or a delusion.
DeleteRemember Capt. Pike in the original Star Trek? He was Capt. Kirk's idol. In the end of his story he was disabled, even though his mind function was good. The Talosians ended up rewarding Pike for saving their lives, by giving him the ILLUSION of perfect health so he could live with his girlfriend Vina.
His body was still disabled. he chose to live in an illusion rather than reality. The problem is that the illusion didn't change the reality. He was dying and his body was decaying.
Why did I reference that? because it is apropos. See, Gene Roddenberry, the creator of Star Trek was an atheist. (he is one no longer as he died and will now testify that God lives) He presented no hope of a future or judgement beyond mortal life. In other words, make the best of it now, for this is all we have. no future hope so why live with any restraint or aside from the ILLUSION that we create?
As Christians, we have a much better assurance and that is because of the resurrected Christ. His resurrection PROVES that there is life beyond this one. If that is true and he has said what he has said by both predicting his death and raising himself as witnessed by multiple individuals in its time and since then...then we are constrained to follow him as he has established the path that we must follow.
So YES, enjoy life, within the constraints that make life more fulfilling and enjoyable and purposeful. those constraints are there to HELP us not hinder us. They are there to keep us from trouble and show us purpose, not simple existence. Now, that path is yours to submit to or yours to reject. But when LIFE is extended, it is the hope of a Christian that LIFE will be taken.
Lastly, within every human being is a concious..a moral compass...where does it come from?..thats a debate too far above my paygrade....part of it comes from how a child is raised....if you are raised in a christian home..your moral compass is most likely God...as is mine..but the older you become you develop your own moral compass...and that could be a combination between a faith in a god or faith in human kindness...for the record I no longer consider myself a christian..def not one of your caliber..or your thinking....i would say I am a liberal christian but thats not realistic.my moral compass for right or wrong is constantly being evaluated...but GOD is at the center and I honor the principles of the teachings of Jesus Christ but I do believe that the Bible is without error and Gods only word...he still speaks...the Bible is a reference book...but the spirit of God lives on beyond revelations....i dont believe in an imaginary hell or the heaven filled with mansions...and gold streets but honestly I have no clue as to what lies after one exits this world...other than that...there will be peace...because when God is in my presence there is peace....
ReplyDeleteAntwoine,
DeleteAnd I THANK YOU for your dialogue. You haven't insulted me although both of us have been direct. That kind of interaction is greatly appreciated.
It is fair that you don't know where morals come from and as you said, that is debatable. All things considered the best explanation is that there is a moral law giver. A dispenser of truth morality and right. There are many arguments I can draw to make that conclusion. To the point however, the home is a good place to foster and nurture morals and we certainly agree, but beyond that those morals come from someplace.
Scientifically, we know that information doesn't simply exist on its own or by itself. Information, especially when it is useful, is ordered or comes from someplace. An intelligent source. This is one of the most stable scientific principles on the universe, the principle of law of causality.
one's moral compass cannot be God. The reason? The moral compass must be developed and it changes with time and age. Both you and I know that. Some things we WISH we would have known back then that we know now. God doesn't change even though our understanding of him does. That changing understanding contributes to proving that he is unchanging. Therefore, that becomes the best proof that our moral compass is NOT and cannot be God. You outline this perfectly in your comment. You admit that you change and that God is, in your opinion, the center....
The problem is that you view the bible similar to Aseop's fairy tales. That is because you are led by carnality. Not because you are stupid or silly, so please let me dispense with any suggestion of the sort. Like many and most men, you can only view so much as the natural or carnal world has its grip. That's OK. That's why I do this. In part to help open eyes and present challenges that you would not otherwise consider.
Now, I pose this to you...Aside from the talk of homosexuality or sexuality at all...IF the bible is NOT God's word and we agree that there is a God (as I can see you believe that) then where do we go to find out this TRUTH that he delivers or has delivered? Has he not delivered truth? If not, or if the truth is undeliverable, then how can we applaud him as God?
I agree the discussion has been respectful...i now see that your objection to the two men isnt based upon "hate" or Biblical reasoning alone....you dont believe it is beneficial to society...and perhaps heterosexuality is because it produces "children"...or offspring....well what about the "mule" it cant reproduce....so it has nothing positive to offer society....?.....your focus on gay people are so negative...and yes there is a lot bad in my community....a lot as is in every community and every society since Adam and Eve, if u believe they even existed...i think they exist only symbolically...the Genedis story is filled with symbolism...you cant tell me that you are missing a rib...are you?...and has a snake ever talked to you?...talked then...should be able to talk now...u get the point......There is a God but the man made canonized King James or Geneva Bible doesnt automatically become his word......can you prove it is his word?...beyond a shadow of doubt?....Truth is overrated......reality is all we know for certain....
DeleteSo you are saying that "reality" is not necessarily "truth"? Then what is man's epistemological basis? how do we "know" anything?
DeleteMy focus. As you say on gay people isn't negative. My commentary on gay normalization is. It is especially challenging if you believe that sexual preference, no matter what that preference is, is a basis for the establishment of law. If you believe that sexual preference can create a "minority" then you won't like me because I think that other sexual minorities deserve more or just as much respect...I mean FREE WARREN JEFFS, if we are serious about fighting for sexual "minorities" or eliminating "sexual bias"...
What am I saying? Homosexual advocacy is a SMOKESCREEN and the biggest FARCE in the world. It is a morally relative argument, trying to take the place of a moral absolute and receive the extension of an "unalienable right". That is a right given by God, whether you believe in HIM or not, that is a right not conferred by men. Homosexual marriage IS NOT, neither has it ever been an unalienable right. It is a LUST of man. A sexual perversion. As proof, NOT a single homosexual ever arrived on earth by any other means except heterosexual union or the intertwining of male and female chromosomes. That is the NORMAL...anything else is a perversion.
That is as simple as I can put it.
So far as the bible...you go down too many "rabbit holes" to correct here. Let's just say that the bible means much more and is much more wealthy in content and construction and is much more of a miracle in preservation than you even begin to touch on in your comment. Yes Genesis is steeped in symbolism, however it is also real and factual. The narrative was birthed in a culture of oral history, and has all the elements of a story, but all the facts of a reality as well. on top of that, the canonization of scripture wasn't because of men, it was because it was unavoidable. What we have simply couldn't be overlooked for a number of reasons and that was observed and examined long before King James.
DeleteThe ability to have a baby is not "normal" its a function of the human body....like having sex is but not all women can birth babies so there normal as you say is not the norm at all...neither is it for men or women that cant have sex....
DeleteIf your focus is not on gay people but gay normalization...do you think gay people are normal?... You must not.....you cant.....somehow we are flawed....and must be corrected...I will be the first to admit that I am not normal.......im unique in every way!...My Life I guess is the NEW normal..but not my new normal.....the last thing I want to be is normal....Jesus wax beyond normal but im not him either....I'm m not you...or anyone else....When God made me he made an original not a carbon copy..lol.....
DeleteThe point I'm making is that it is a "normal" function of the body for a woman to have a baby. Her physiology facilitates that. She has the design necessary from a physiological, engineering, and even mental capacity standpoint. It is approved further by nature with the "ability" or "potential" to reproduce given exclusively to her. Whether a particular women can or cannot have a child is aside from the point. The factors are yet present that facilitates the result.
DeleteWhat I mean by "gay normalization" is the view that there needs to be an accommodation within the law and otherwise because of the "attraction" that gays have. That is unfounded and ridiculous. Folk want to be gay, do that...everyone has their freedom. However, noone has the freedom to change what is right and or single out a singular sexual proclivity, ordain it and tell everyone to honor it. NO...neither I or anyone else has to be made to honor perversion in any form. Why the exception with homosexuality? It's because of the POLITICS and nothing else.
The politics?....thats your beef?....i think I understand your view...you are concerned that Gay Marriage and the normalization of marriage will change the world and corrupt it...the world will lose its morality.........dont be so afraid...we Gays are the minority..regardless of the politics and what is made legal....we still the minority.....the majority will rule.....The US will always be a prodominantly pro male, heterosexual society........Obama wont be president forever....although I wish he could....he has been good for us gays politically and so is the DNC..because of the white gay money...lol....its all about money.....not sexuality....money will be the downfall of the Western Civilization....sexuality is a problem...in the black community that needs to be addressed.....black folk need to have a sexual emancipation proclamation...in fact the entire Western Civilization needs one.......
DeleteCorrection: I DONT believe the Bible is without error!!!!!!!...
ReplyDeleteProof positive that the blind cannot see their error, thus they justify it. Like a blind man setting a forest fire and saying, well I was cold. Nevermind all the destructive aftermath. To them the means justifies the end and the current existence. Its just another variation of the excesses of man's deeply foolish and flawed thinking due mainly to sin. Like an alzheimer strain, sin infects and there is no remedy except one by faith see their deplorable condition and trust Christ by faith. Only then will they be able to understand the real danger of denying self evident truth.
ReplyDeletePastor Burnett . . . your stand is based on your understanding that you have a correct interpretation of the Bible and thus you know the truth . . . I respect your conviction . . . at the same time your readers rail against "stealing babies" which is not true . . . have you ever heard of surrogate mothers who carry a fertilized seed of the fathers . . . so you are disparaging the natural father of his child . . . you may want to know that they are legally married in Washington DC and if DOMA falls in a challenge in front of the US Supreme Court, Georgia will have to recognize their marriage . . . it doesn't matter if you or I agree . . . finally on the inerrant nature of your interpretation of the Bible . . . there are many reasons that any legitimate Hebrew Rabbi will tell you that what you call the old testament is not correctly translated . . . and neither is there any scripture in what you call the "old testament" linked to the birth, death, nor resurrection of Jesus . . . the final error is in "a second coming" that is not supported, nor "foretold" in the Bible . . . there was no need for Jesus because the Hebrew religion already provides a route to salvation . . . unless you have a DHL (Doctor of Hebrew Letters) I'm not going to argue about mistranslations neither will I explain THE reason that Hebrew people do not accept Greek transcripts for translation of the Bible. . . because you are a reasonable and learned man I would hope that you would bother to take the time to investigate the real reasons that Judaism rejects any notion of salvation based upon the Romanization of the Hebrew religion or even the need for a "redeemer" . . . if you even bother to look at Hebrew requirements for the prophecy validity you will why many would consider some New Testament prophecy "false prophecy" . . . because "no kingdom" was established and definitely not one that would lead to the persecution and death of the chosen people by Christians through the Inquisition, the Crusades, the Hundred Years War, World War I, World War II, etc. . . and Christianity is further confused by its foundation based on a man who did not meet Jesus, never sat under his teaching, and came after the great commission to the apostles . . . amazing that the new Testament claimed that Jesus said "it is finished" yet you imply that he said "Paul is coming" . . . interesting and amazing . . . I simply ask that Christians check for an approved Hebrew translation of the Bible after all that is the source claimed to foretell and validate the death, burial, and resurrection Jesus . . . I believe a correct interpretation will not support any of these claims . . . and at that point you will be left with G_d alone, supreme, and without equal who needs no supporting character nor elaborate story
ReplyDeleteD Williams,
DeleteThanks for commenting and I appreciate what you are saying. Of course we will disagree and I'll go into a few points as to why...
First, the "bishop" and his/(pretend her) man/pretend woman, lives in GA., a state that doesn't recognize gay marriage as legal. Marriage between a man and a woman is "recognized" in every state. So it doesn't matter where they were married, unlike traditional marriage, it is not recognized where they are. So they are in violation of the law. I doubt if DOMA will be overturned by the Supreme Court. They don;t make or establish law under the Constitution, which is something the seems to be a foreign concept for many ultra liberals such as you "seem" to be. Simply because President Obama won't defend traditional marriage, doesn't mean he is right. In fact he is setting a deplorable precedent to pick and chose the law of the citizenry which is not in line with a free democratic republic, but is more in line with a monarchy or demagoguery. That's simply another of the many administration's failures on this issue and others as well.
The point is that no matter if this baby was fertilized with OC's or Rashard's seed, theirs (those 2 men's)seed intermingled in NO WAY to create anything. ONE of those sperm connected with a true FEMALE'S egg and chromosomes were exchanged and life was created. So the 'FATHER(S)" haven;t been disparaged at all...one man has along with his illicit unlawful homosexual lover....What you do is perpetuate "pretend" and "make believe" which leads me to the more interesting commentary about your rejection of the bible, in part because of supposed mistranslation and nonacceptance by the Jews....I'll handle that next....
D. Williams,
DeleteSo far as the agreement of Rabbi's or Jewish Hebrew "scholars" who disagree with scriptural interpretations and appellations of Jesus, his lordship and Messianic Office...what else is new? The bible itself is replete with rejection of Jesus by the Jews who saw him face to face. Remember it was those Hebrew leaders that called for crucifixion wasn't it? They developed the first apologetic against the resurrection claiming that the body was stolen didn't they?
Matthew 28:11-15~"11-Now when they were going, behold, some of the watch came into the city, and shewed unto the chief priests all the things that were done. 12-And when they were assembled with the elders, and had taken counsel, they gave large money unto the soldiers, 13-Saying, Say ye, His disciples came by night, and stole him away while we slept. 14-And if this come to the governor's ears, we will persuade him, and secure you. 15-So they took the money, and did as they were taught: and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day."
Josh McDowell, like many biblical scholars, undertook to explain why the traditional Jews are wrong on this point and have to deal with scripture that unmistakably points to Jesus as both Lord and Messiah, in his books, "Evidence For Christianity", "Evidence That Demands A Verdict", and "The New Evidence That Demands A Verdict". In each case he points to over 61 prophetic utterings, statements and sayings undisputed by most reputable Jewish scholars, that Jesus fulfilled contained within the Old Testament and that could have only been fulfilled in Jesus time and no other. In other words if Jesus didn't do it, it can't be done now and the entire scriptures including Judaism as a religion, is wrong and the scriptures are no more valuable than anything else that has been around a long time. Now do you really want to argue that?
The fact is that though we find variations on certain Hebrew words on occasion, and learn more and more how words were used in certain situations, it is the FRINGE scholarship that believes that the OT was "mistranslated" or that any significant meaning is or was uprooted by new discoveries. Further it is that same fringe that would not hold to the authenticity of scripture. most reputable scholars worth their salt all agree in the message and content of the OT scriptures as being authentic. That argument has been dealt with for over 100 years, since the new schools of form criticism that arose in Germany years ago. So there is really nothing new to see about your argument there either.
So far as the "Pauline Supremacy" of scripture, I believe that is another novel speculation with very little substance applied. The fact is that Jesus from Gen. 3:15 onward the belief that the Messiah would bruise satan's head. Jesus claimed to be the messiah and demonstrated that by establishing HIS kingdom (which you seem to be oblivious of in your argument) demonstrating his power and authority over sin, by forgiving it, sickness and disease, by healing it, the elements, by commanding it, and death itself, by the immutable fact of the resurrection which the JEWS conspired to cover up.
DeleteThe "plurality of majesty" and the arguments claiming that Isaiah 53 was the nation of Israel were much later developments post 12 century developments, to combat the preaching of Jesus as the Messiah which was successful in converting Jews by the droves even as it is today.
Now, that leads back to the point doesn't it? IF the scriptures are real, as the majority of scholars believe they are and as the most reputable authorities on the OT believe as well, then we are constrained that 1- there is a God, 2- he has communicated truth and 3- HIS truth is not "our" truth in that HIS word was not meant to be picked over and chosen based on what we "like" or don't like. In fact that WORD becomes the basis for all truth now doesn't it?
now where does HOMOSEXUALITY fit in that word? Somewhere around Leviticus 10 and 20 is a good starting place. The NT authors headed out by Paul, further SUPPORT those same OT values. Not uproots them, but builds on top of them preaching a Jesus who is not gay, doesn't endorse gaydom, but sets the CAPTIVE FREE from their sins, including ALL sexually immoral sins INCLUDING homosexuality....
What is so hard to acknowledge about that IF the interest is TRUTH?????
You mentioned that you doubt that the US Supreme Court will not overturn DOMA..on the grounds that its role is to uphold existing Law rather than create new ones...funny...the opponents of Thurgood Marshall made the same claim when Marshall represented families from SC..in the famous seperate but equal case....Thurgood presented the court not with a legal defense of the law...but he urged the courts to make a moral decision...discrimination is morally wrong on all grounds..an unjust law is no law at all!...The courts will right a wrong and make marriage equality the law of the Land!!!!!!!!!!....if your logic held true in the past...we would still be seperate but unequal.....
ReplyDeleteAlthough this article is irrelevant and your following is unknown,
ReplyDeleteI decree and declare in the Name of Jesus that according to Isaiah 54:13 great shall be the peace of the children of Bishop O C Allen and First gentleman Rashad Burgess. I declare that your words of negativity are condemned and a divine cancelation of your satanic prayers against this move of God. I further the favor of God upon them and decree a destruction to the ignorance you post. May your private lust for men be exposed (Luke 8:17) and the hurt of your past be healed so that you can promote the KINGDOM of light (colossians 1:13). I plead the blood of Jesus against the Spirit of self hatred and private secret lust that bubble over into unhealthy devotions to websites of hatred and jealousy. I release the anointing of liberation by way of the SPIRIT!
IN JESUS NAME AMEN
Keep you WITCH and WARLOCK prayers to yourself! The WRATH of God is upon ALL children of disobedience!
DeleteCol. 3:5-6 ~5-Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: 6-For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:"
UNCLEANLINESS was to be MORTIFIED or put to death in the flesh, meaning to be forsaken along with fornication and all sorts of inordinate affection. Thne there is Ephesians which says:
Ephesians 5:3-7: 3-But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; 4-Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. 5-For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. 6-Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. 7-Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
This gaydom and homosexuality and them claiming that God has anything to do with it by way of approval is SICK and spiritually PSYCHOTIC! You are NOT or do not have anything to do with being Apostolic...you are ANTI-CHRIST and ungodly and in your sins! The APOSTLES would have been ashamed of you and cast the devil witchcraft out of you.
Don't even try to send a curse here...the curse is destroyed IN THE NAME OF JESUS!